Politics this of course is the week that starts off tomorrow with Labor Day and for those who don't quite remember it's really more than just the end this summer. And there are those in the labor community that gather each year not only to celebrate the past but also to look I -- the past year. That's what we're going to be doing this next hour Michael -- birdies here. From the buffalo area AFL CIO labor council. He's basically the head of the umbrella group for the buffalo area of most AFL CIO labor unions. We talking a little bit along the way about the changes and make the challenges they face this past year. If you'd like to get in on the conversation we would love to have you do that 8030930. The number. Michael thanks for stopping by great appeared in one of these years and have you win some other time and just before Labor Day but in the meantime this is the annual here and yes and we're glad to hear. We started out this past hour talking a lot about politics in Albany and that's where I'd like to begin with you. Has the AFL CIO endorsed the governor is it likely they will. No the AFL CEO hasn't endorsed the governor we -- convention a couple weeks ago in New York City. But. You know there was a large split. -- the affiliates. Particularly the building trades because of -- -- of the buffalo billion its common those people are very busy. However on the public sector side they haven't and -- while ago at the tears six in. A number of the cuts that we've lost about 9000 state employees since the governor's office that didn't fare too well the house is he liberal enough for the hardcore Unionist. He's very popular with some of my members in the very unpopular with the with the others. You know it's hard to say I think he's he's walked in the -- there. And is in danger do you think of file off the fence I mean these are people that are probably not likely won't vote for rob mastering thing. I think the -- -- OK and -- on the problem. But you know in the labor movement because. Some animosity. Public sector. We just couldn't couldn't see -- to endorse what about in the primary. That we we -- you know the primaries in the primaries in many times the primaries are the election. We just didn't see it he needed our help -- one. Ordered because of some. Things we've gone up against them. This you talked about how well both the building trades and some of the public sector unions -- sort of split on this guy. This might be a good point talk about with the buffalo AFL CIO labor council is. Are you both the public sector unions and the building trades guys -- winner. We represent people from all walks public sector private sector. -- from people that -- hospitals for the people apply our streets. We pretty much too well. And how many unions locally does that represent just basic background. Well that -- probably 120 different locals that we present this. Is the Western New York buffalo area more public sector unions some private sector and we're probably. Pretty close to even but I would say that the that the public sectors probably 54. I don't ask you too much about disputes that are bigger than buffalo papers say. But talk to me about that the status of the policy -- this past year since the last Labor Day. There was. A little bit of a tipped with Teamsters and -- CIU polling out of the AFL CIO. Well the Teamsters and this year you have been changed to win partners for a number of -- what is that. There there actually participating. Through solidarity charters in the house counsel's. The ACLU and in the Teamsters. Several years ago it politely -- policy with some mothers and it was changed to win group. And every one except for the Teamsters and this was come back in the -- okay. What was changed to win why did they pull out to do that when when is that well they were looking for a for more organizing the number of different. More of push. Bringing people. Believe at the time -- -- that the Fazio was kind of going soft. As far as pushing for other members and word about other issues but you know -- policy that was all part of a bigger page. Trying to keep all of those things in the box and going. Can be very difficult is slavery united. I would say here in Western New York we most certainly. You know the Teamsters -- you being changed when I've never looked at the capital's affiliates and any differently. Actually we work very well together western I can't speak to compare. And and similarly you said when it comes the governor races or politics there's there's to some degree split. Is this a more fractious year overall on the political side. Well you know folks from the building trades came to me and they were they're they're very heavily support. So I do expect that the -- will be giving support from the building trade unions but -- That the umbrella organization idea folks know they like the Buffalo Bill. -- 8030930s. Or number we are talking about the labor movement in -- around buffalo. Of course tomorrow is Labor Day that's the day they do you have the big Labor Day parade and -- Michael tell me a little bit about that traditionally starts on ever rode around 11 o'clock holiest does it it's my favorite event I can tell -- laughing answers that -- that you smiled with that right now it's such a great time that we use that we have a -- first of votes and Thomas points through -- angels of -- they put. And we little refreshments after that's at 9 AM. Rhode it's economies. And afterwards and it was circuits and for the -- about 11 o'clock the pre kicks off the front of the virus honored to read at -- And we locked down and wrote down is no via into the park and there we're gonna have a big picnic -- -- -- offering. Why I -- that that's almost a stupid question for me to -- but I think it allows you tell the story why celebrate labor. -- -- You know for me it's. It's the one day of the year that we we celebrate America's workers and in the sacrifices that people have made. You know with Labor Day coming up I was going over some different things and came across. Some photos from New York City for example. And you look at when they built the Chrysler Building an Empire State Building those type things. Everybody's very familiar with the the construction workers by the IB you know we've got a statue out of there. And transit road there in front of -- from Brussels everybody's familiar with it the next time you look at it take a look at those those exit -- no safety harnesses you know they're just sitting there in mid -- no helmets. And -- all those things -- thanks to labor. Thought a lot of those people got lost you know -- unfortunately they died on the job and that's one of the things that we're fighting -- to against. We wanna make sure that America's workers get their fair share and the theme of this year's parade is united we bargain divided weekday. And I think that they're pretty much tells the whole story what labor's about you know united we all do better together. Who's the the grand Marshal listeners know that something that he cheer they sort of dole out to different people and this is a political year yes. This year we didn't our grand marshals on political officials and elected official. It's float trip -- from CS CA -- six okay. Flow has been a real strong advocate for working people here and continues to do so so well. We're gonna have froze flow in the car tomorrow lecture it's going to be a convertible or what it's going to be but. She's the pride of labor movement this year. And it's interesting that you've picked her to be the -- of the labor movement I would say and and maybe maybe it's just an assumption on my part but I would say that. Labor unions when you look at membership and when you look at activism. In Western New York are more often the public sector side than the private sector now. No not really. You know from from -- crisis. Really our our our affiliates are very good. You know I can looked at CWA people. You know those those folks are private sector phone company owners that kind of thing. They're fully engaged so time SP CA CA path their their -- wells everybody's working very hard together what about numbers though membership numbers do you have more public sector were unionized workers here. Than you do private sector unionized workers around here. I would say slightly slightly. Slightly that that I don't like he is is also change. With the influx of construction and we've seen around town fortunately this year. A lot of our union files have been -- and that means everybody's working which is a great thing for -- from Western New York for the community you know it. It takes to better cover businesses so. It's it's been a good year -- really he has 8030930s. And number. Lets us squeeze in a couple of phone calls that were almost ready for our break and we'll do them just a moment or two but we bring in John and Rochester if we can. And Joseph I'm having trouble on my hand I think he's up he's ready. Let's hi John John is LOK. Hey -- they might like it all up -- -- support labor union. He movement. Nonunion and union -- and that was the number of a union recognition of the work pension plan not awful but. -- with the label laws we have that it -- IC. We don't need for a public sector unions in fact STR. -- against public sector unions feeling it would be unfair advantage. Let the taxpayers would have to put -- And in fact in New York State is quite yet. The Ohio State government to the point of -- this state is in bad financial shape. And so part of the student public -- And we're doing they're doing on the backs of the taxpayers -- 80% are not members of public -- So why I -- you know there's. Is picnic at about trying to make New York State right to work stately. Indiana. Obviously it has gone through to a certain extent in Wisconsin I think your -- movement to go direct to work because. The abuse of the public sector union. In most states and our state. I know you're not gonna advocate apple why don't you think right to work states are good idea Mike. Their villages -- You know. Unions are about having a collective voice in the workplace and to see that public employee should have home. I couldn't really disagree more to be honest with you. Well -- -- I guess they got small company and more and I unionize. In my workforce is collectively. Representative. Represented and I think that the majority of the public in this country and he's -- movement and they'll want it. You're okay having a unionized workforce you're you're in that regard not anti union. Yeah I would be I if if if if the people were in favor of that sure what that a majority of people in this country. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- The up manufacturing industry in the blood flow. Wiped out. To a large extent because of the you can by the unit -- have steal anybody else's organ but we're still I worked ER. These union and making our car radiator -- nearly seventy -- all the abuse that I can give you opened the example of abusive. In -- -- propriety unions. That public unions and you can carry over -- public sector also. I've heard you enough on this program as a regular caller before your big -- though I would think is that that it it it forces on the public sector side. Governments to do things that they can't afford. They exactly I think that's sort of the major abuse and then let fly out. Was tag team. -- -- unbelievable -- what he did it in the apple is and you are the abuse. Ended turmoil it happened that the union cause. That under read it went out and Wisconsin. Where they didn't work out. The end. That's right the people of the country deserve better end up with the state labor laws we got the federal laws we have. There's no need for raw. The abuses especially new York state of the public sector union and to a certain extent that -- union cured themselves not. Our court cases recently where there's been firewood cause they union activity. In the awful area in Niagara counties so I think that but I had to go to our right to work state. And -- the people this stay in this country. Real Leo. Create enough fair manner in big they're important with how the pressure belonging to a union. Do you think Michael and thanks for the call John do you think Michael that in the public sector side. There aren't too many burdens put on government which doesn't necessarily have the flexibility. Of a regular employer. Absolutely. I think a lot of people such as -- today have a misconception of the public sector. Unions in particular. Public sector unions in most cases can't strike and they do straight you know to go to jail there there heavily fine the there you know penalized day's pay and so on and so forth. You know that's one thing that the that the private sector doesn't deal with a lot of people don't see that you know like I get a lot of complaints about the Taylor wants and so forth but. Those things -- put in place also protect the public. Now it's been my experience as a public employee did you. Thirty years in with the city of buffalo. And I have seen a switch where we have gone from having public sector employees such as engineers architects and most -- things. When we had people on staff working in the city of buffalo. That would work on many many jobs throughout a year and these these people they're not they're not they don't get paid the same as what the people make in the private sector there generally pay considerably us. -- but they usually have decent benefit packages particularly because of the unions and collective bargaining. But what I've seen in my thirty years is I've seen a lot of work go out the door and in the interest of privatization. And we you know we don't wanna pay people's health care and so and so forth. People need health care they need those type of benefits when you go to look for a -- I just just to -- the lowest wage canto a workforce now you wanna do the best that you can't. But what's what's happened in the public sector in particular is with privatization. We subcontract these jobs are now pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for engineering and architectural work and design. And then when a change needs to be me we got to go back to that consultant and we got to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars more. Whereas before we hit again we are probably paying 42000 dollars a year as an engineer and architect worker for the city of awfully decent benefit package who could just -- to find that job interviews regarding the short answer a single day. That you know I I get a lot of people don't seedy inner workings particularly in the public sector. Book before he authored bashing you really shouldn't you at least see what the public sector does actually do for you and how how -- the -- column just because of the way it's managed it's a lower it's lower cost to conduct business when you have public sector employees doing the work. Then when you subcontracted. Out to consulting contractors. It much higher costs is they have to pay their employees at that they cancel the contract and they have to pay their benefit packages. And make a profit on top when you have public sector employees that are working for the city yes they have the benefit packages in the rest of it. But it's not costing as much as it -- set them. 8030930s. -- number -- takes more calls after this also interesting. This of course is Labor Day coming up in the past year there have been a couple of court rulings that looked at the role of organized labor. -- Wisconsin of course the justices upheld their union limits there. And the Supreme Court touched a little bit on the with withholding of dues money. We'll touch on that after this Michael hole -- -- is here from the AFL CIO labor council in buffalo 8030930s. The number. More straight ahead it's hard news radio 930 WB yen are you can start by. Thirty healthy again this -- people. Michael hole for this year he's president of the buffalo area AFL CIO labor council. Of course on this day before Labor Day that's why he's in we're talking about all the changes to labor movement this past year. And some of the issues they face if you'd like to raise a few and so pro had a few callers do that 8030930s. Number let's bring in and in buffalo high year you're sort of a counterpoint to John in Rochester. I cannot guarantee that there were prepared -- he gave me confidence. And the next we're desire to our right to work state and public sector unions. And then taking a different opinion and I respect independent purposes and I'm in the community in general that the history of rivalry created this place. That's number one. Particular considered accurate in the hunger in America. In China. So. You -- representation is very important. That could be the American Medical Association. -- look at the screen actors -- in California. Look at them and be able -- open he prepared for and and and if they didn't think it approved are people that lately it's like a pig and we detained. That company and it and any other competitive and people have to be appointed to the table -- And appreciate. I honestly. The pan -- and -- and Hispanic and Hispanic businessman and I understand that could be competitive. And the purpose a little -- global market. I wouldn't have to rest a bit desperate to competition. But more finger in the old cabinet and a good example of what -- be done to compete today. Reported at the moment we were made them. And -- and the job and I'm not here because it. Propriety. And some of the patent number could. -- depend. Overtime. Which India and China and and -- -- -- -- that -- different. I received a private equity and the -- -- and independence parade. Can you hope they were late for our news -- pick it up on the other side of the -- on hold and and do that. If you can't stick with us will will chatting and some other time. It's hard line and his radio 930 WB and news radio 930 WB and good morning this is Dave -- It of course is the day before Labor Day Michael hope -- this year he's the president of the AFL CIO council in the buffalo area. We're talking a little bit about the role of unions the challenges they face may -- the losses and victories since this past year's Labor Day let's bring -- in buffalo back in. Ed was talking a lot about jobs in the need for unions and I know you're you're someone calls the show a lot and and oftentimes. I appreciate that. Oftentimes you're the one that that argues that too many -- too many jobs have gone to China where the wages are low. And if you argue that and if you argue as Michael does that the purpose of the union is kind of bargain for among other things wages. Doesn't that mean that unions have to give concessions in order to bring jobs back to America. Yeah. It's definitely put it put it just proves that this country is an important. Management. -- -- he expected to hit it over. And really be for each other I mean. The entire trip. I understand. What what'd I. Preliminary country. A big -- basic. And particularly -- I understand that tour but did you -- it and really spent properly considered the that the Japanese. There will be administered. They're separated the public safety and -- and open appropriately independently. They believe bringing in the last eight. Because they'll look at comeuppance and as I did that make their product better and appeared in the -- for -- -- believe. With the company. Direct effect that it sort of and it helps to reduce our media eliminates costly mistakes were puzzled experts have. So for you the issue is bigger and I am guessing Michael this where your -- come on and the the issue is bigger than just wages. That's right. That's exactly right now. The call when you talk about. -- you can't just talk about wage you have to talk talk about living conditions and you look at the living conditions over there in China you've seen the stuff on TV how those people live in the and that the literal penny that they are paid for some of it the very intricate work that they do. You you know you work -- to make yourself better to to raise your family. You know over there in China and Japan they've got things set ups that you know. The company's control the people. That's solid the United States is about right -- we're about who we're all in this together that's what America's about about being united. That's why I take Labor Day so seriously and great call that would really truly. And in a lot of ways I think some of the things you've discussed. Have certainly been embraced by the industrial unions. Steelworkers have a lot of cooperation going with a lot of management in a lot of places I think the public perception -- -- Mike is still that. On the public sector side it's it's more of trench warfare. It shouldn't be that mean you know Matt the people who work in the public sector to go to work every day they expected to emerge and -- paid fairly for. You know that -- you know working together with the companies in the plants and a before idea became public sector employees have worked as a machinist program. And I used to work on a particular machine and used to do this particular for this company all the time in the immediate change. And you know I remember you know I had to machine this part I noticed that this one particular dimension was different. And because of that I knew that you know -- it was a bearing race that type thing -- I knew that it was fitting -- this other -- a product to the attention of the inspector. Inspector came down called the company that we would manufacturing apart for. Sure enough there was -- mistake draw while. But you know if I would have picked that up I would have machine the park as the as it was -- and it would have been very expensive script pieces but isn't that the obligation of any employee why is that sort of a union issue. It's not unions it's it's it's just what it's for example of the kind of cooperation you think should be right there you know it it is it's it goes both ways it's given -- That's what negotiation is all about you know some people have this impression that you know union goes to the table miles into them and you know this race high wages attack yeah write about it and that it really is not the way it works at the negotiating. Jim in North Carolina hi thanks for waiting. Yeah column I wanna pay off. -- for the job for Rochester that would that's that he was against. -- he he has are perennial right to work state caller. Out let me tell you how unions I was retired New York State correctional officer. With a memorable public sector union for 2.5 years in our work. In -- in empowers the workers are giving apple a little while before it retired. I was working readable -- -- that went. In it was shot cable prevent certain noble noble guy -- cell block. All at my political. In wanted to run. And also wanted to run help block a certain way. Now for bad things happen probably in the -- -- that are like minded everybody. Works toward the goal unfortunately. You've got a lot of liberals -- The block sergeant came to me it was -- forbid all these jobs are bid because we have unions in New York State it was up for New York. My political views. Among my coworkers and supervisors. Were well -- -- -- the right and most issue. IE was very outspoken that is right that New York State correction officers. No matter what any go and work states as well that upper upper that. State police and propagation of fire arms we will actively been. -- bite humans are well well they can't -- that -- allot a certain individual. Working on the black. -- whatever does that have the correct political opinion. We -- you -- it it's got you got the most you'll be you'll get it it will keep the -- body. We figured if you fall short now I did the job in the liberal. I'd -- the Japanese we can whining -- common and we make sure that it wanted to work in our area. Book written about. Did that work and here. And I imagine. In a prison I imagine -- that the -- cohesiveness is probably a huge priority for someone. It has spent like you've got a bucket I think Warner writes I don't -- wonder what it's like -- in the first and make up satellite we're gonna that your business. But for bad things happen. You gotta have like minded guy that they belong to invite the Columbus estimate that in our -- and all the way. Let the same way you have been political views and then you can talk. But that's why -- The liberal now in the -- a guy like me right in the shelf forever. -- unions typically. Politically I mean you look at their endorsement certainly. Deemed to be thought to be more liberal than than the average worker. The rank and file -- it was a -- -- -- guys -- that I worked with if you got the area. What you would call profile sure. After nine elevenths. There were org site and I can think of that for a period of 345. Years totally. Appeared they -- not the war for their country they were rank and file union members were also members. Of while local army National Guard and reserve units by Hillary retired from the national air when 9/11 epidemic would not let me come out of retirement but anyway. -- -- got the guys I'm talking about our McDyess to win 9/11 effort went off to war guys -- Way way things. Kill every level basis on the bases with her tiny -- they all -- like me. Talk like me walk like me -- we got a law. I think he -- I. I think you raise an issue though you are and I I've heard you call the programs here before you are certainly a hardcore Unionist and you are certainly a a fiscal not just overall conservative. -- I mean you know I I I am I believe. Like you can put that type of pocket public unions. Have been a lot of talk about the right way. And that may in the cup are you familiar with -- it would replace -- polish falcons sure got kicked out of the year you know light. Because it that we report read -- prison guards like in quality of -- in -- Do do you have a problem if you're such a hard -- Unionist and the conservative. Do you have a problem with some of the political endorsements and and the money that unions. From our union. We felt old blogger record setting up -- and you know. That we can't be represented by and other union that the site. All of -- guys got together of the rank and file any guys I was telling you about got out got together we -- those guys credit here. We checked it out and brought it that you started open here and it's there. -- -- die from that that the that the -- they say man you guys some western Mississippi River fuel budget they would talk. You guys read blogs or late wavered. Hard hit construction worker fights are being guide marine -- military guys you guys at all. You know that we -- we. Right -- fire union members are the guy who's been with -- So you guys changed unions because of the politics. Right because activity capable bite out of -- about making it up with -- the airport I think it was meaning New York City. And somebody that they have now if you are. The U directive is the vice president. Of the front door mayor -- terminal. Charge you more if you could. -- -- -- -- hit -- -- -- -- car -- yourself and it would baker was using certain select. That. You know why am and then one -- I don't yeah I don't know who are your prison guard with a high school equivalency diploma out of my face. While but Jim let me let me just thank you for your service first I really appreciate that that's all that and that's what we have the freedom that we do in this country. The you know I'd also like to you know that the -- right as far as the union knows if you're not happy with that you do have the ability that you can. That you can change unions he does raise the issue to that. And look at what the Supreme Court did this past -- since last Labor -- in my. Harris vs Quinn. Home health care workers in Illinois. Can no longer be compelled to financially support unions that don't necessarily reflect their political views granted that's just Illinois. But did you see that kind and spreading. Get the kind of things though he's been out there you know. I understand that not everyone shares -- not everyone is like mindedly mean you know legitimate for everyone was like mindedly and you probably wouldn't have the job. I mean we are we are a melting pot always have been always will be and you know as as the union person that I am it's always been my concern to represent everyone as a whole. I realized that you know people have different ways of life that do different things for living. But at the end of the day we're all trying to get the same place were trained to make it through -- in the working world. Have a dignified retirement those things. If if the template that the Supreme Court picked up and placed down on -- would go nationwide. You quote half of workers being represented by the union. That aren't paying into the union you're OK with that -- -- There there if if the partner freeloaders Hewitt next for you would say that you know if the person does not want to contribute. By paying dues -- per cap that is called. Played it simply why should be have the same rights and privileges. As the other people that have paid to too. And they they have paid for the representation it's not just about paying union officers. I mean there's lawyers and all those different types of things. But somebody had asked to foot the bill what if the dues go to advocacy rather than though. Safety issues lawyers collective bargaining. It would work that I just I can't see that you know advocates you've gotta you gotta have boots on the ground you gotta you gotta get him. All right stand in Rochester stay right there will get you next we're overdue for a break. More with Michael whole -- after this he's the president of the buffalo AFL CIO council its -- and news radio 930 WB. All right sorry about that looks like we're having a little bit of a technical difficulty we will try to bring you law all of the commercial message is that you use to hear eventually let's continue the discussion. With Michael offered AFL CIO council it's hard line this is Dave Tebow and let's bring in stand in Rochester thanks for waiting -- about that -- here. Good morning gentlemen. It's like -- -- And they can get a little you can turn -- -- 19100. The ball and -- demand comes to children were driven cars hit me. Certainly paid no income taxes. And people were fifty cents an hour and nobody writes. The conservatives most of them would like to take us back there. Now let's get in the real world it cost money to live in the United States. If you want to do away with these public sector capital you know wages. Firemen and what they should do -- -- next time. They need a -- still bother calling. They don't know it's. -- to know about this project apple could see how much money you were before you guy. -- and you know. You you hit the nail right on the head when you go back to those things and indeed the today if you look at for example social secured. You know a millionaire CEO is paying the same and Social Security that somebody that pays a 1151151000. Dollars us. You wonder -- systems in trouble. People paying their fair share where does where does it get to the point where. Where you just while I don't have to pay taxes anyway I've paid enough yes the more you work the more you pay it's just the that's the name of the game and signals. For governor -- polls if you're saying we're aware that changes things which -- we ought to pay the same rate. Yeah I don't have a problem it's -- paying the same rate -- you know if you wanna save percentage to it but you know you get to this amount of 1151000. Dollars which many years ago what Social Security was up. Was like a million herself. But today you know you've got millionaires who got billionaires. And they're just not paying their fair share. What about the rationale and I hate to sound like Mitt Romney corporations a person here. Maybe don't hate -- In and present company Hampshire that's not popular argument. Don't these companies have a greater power to create jobs then the guy down below. Therefore don't they deserve the breaks loopholes etc. Now. You know everybody's puts the CEO on a pedestal. You know I I sit on the Erie county industrial development -- businesses are common in left and right for inducements just because they can. Under our state laws. So when they need inducement or tax breaks you and I pay for. But do we have the title of CEO and president of that company absolutely not do we get any of the prophet at that company makes for. That the assistance that we gave them. To get that -- started. Nothing but is taxpayers we have made significant investment in them giving. Standing still with us doing a lot of what can you. -- quickly do that we'll let you go back to a lot of. See what countries good old country. Now if you look at socialist country usually go to England and Canada. We will feel we controlled 37% of the kind of the world -- these 11% more to spread among the people. -- gives them a better life but once you -- according 38%. And they're creating -- the end and that doing a damn thing it's pretty quiet. The 27%. What we're we're going. I I think they would argue that there are employing the middle class is that enough stand. No because the battle lines on there it is. The middle class is also making them -- That's right all right apparently pretty stand. Fair enough thanks for the call we are almost out of time here Michael. Once again tell me about the parade tomorrow on them -- go anyway. Yeah the parade is gonna be taken off at noon rate for the Irish Setter there's going to be candy for the kids. All kinds of on the picnic afterwards. Really come on down enjoy -- it's a wonderful wonderful time we've got activities for the kids in the park tents on and so forth in itself free. So 11 o'clock in front of the Irish has run as a set -- time the police official kick start kick off time is new. And so the root of where people would wanna watch it would be anywhere from. The -- and I never relevant -- is down to -- -- all right forget Michael thanks again they think you have agreed -- -- but one of these years and get you -- -- general issues when they're in the news instead of saying hey it's Labor Day but it has -- so thanks for stopping -- happy to -- that'll do it for this this week's edition of the program Meet the Press straight ahead after these messages. On news radio 930 WB again. It eventually. They're gonna I. I I get a telltale on our engineers at least our our our our technical producers. They are working behind the scenes today with a system that is thoroughly new and different. So while we have just a little more time here with Michael hole for two talk a little bit about some of the issues facing labor. Mike thanks for not excluding other -- too quickly pledges still here. By the way Meet the Press does come your way today at twelve noon. And at that doesn't involve a computer this is something with a press button or two and that'll come your way coming down the pike at twelve noon. One area we did not get to touch on Mike. And I know what sort of -- a bone of contention in the state legislature is the idea of the scaffold law. New York State is one of the few in the entire nation that has this thing it's basically called the scaffold law that requires employers and building sites. Two ensure the safety of -- when their up in the air and a lot of business trades. And yeah. Business interest have started a coalition to try and get rid of this. Their argument is that it's just way too costly New York State is the only state that has -- their argument in a lot of ways is that. State. Deregulation have come so far so forward that it is now obsolete given the other the other side of that -- The fortunate we still have people that killed one of these days. Yeah I don't know if we can ever maker workers to safe. You know I've seen you know different pieces of the scaffold on -- -- mentioned earlier when you look at those pictures from New York City when they were building the Chrysler Building in the Empire State Building. There wasn't safe I mean these guys were jumping around from loose planks and and so on and so forth in the hundreds of thousands of thousands of feet in the air. You know. Safety is something that you have to be mindful of yet to be diligent maintained. And you know we had a young gentleman that was killed locally here a couple years ago and still didn't haven't found out what the actual cause was -- -- I've heard the defeat if you had a harness on Murphy was tethered. He would be libelous. Well that that in part I think it's part of the debate here. When injuries or or even death result under the scaffold while the law says that. The contractors and the owners are liable some of these people wanna throw -- lot -- say. Yeah but there's some worker responsibility there too if the guy's not wearing his harness if he's not doing what he should. He bears some liability. In the event that comes to a court. I understand that particular piece of it but you know when you look at these construction jobs you have inspectors on their for the quality of the work to make sure that things were done correctly. You know is gonna get to the point where people think that that is to ominous to do that well these these guys should know what they're doing and if it's not on the right. You know to have a safety inspector on the job to make sure that these people are complying with the regulations to make sure that they don't. If it's expensive I understand it but the cost of life to me that's priceless and you can't replace that. In a lot of ways it's just a Tug of war two there isn't actual legislation to. Keep this thing or to repeal this thing. There's just lobbyist sunny side beginning to argue a lot more this past here all right. Now I think we're we're at a point where we can say that we'll do it for this week's program.